**Please remember to rate and review the podcast – it really helps others to find it.**

Christina Pickworth founded THIS MAMA DOES in 2016. With a background in film & television she’d spent over a decade telling stories, but when she became a mother she felt suddenly invisible. Then she had an idea for funny parenting milestone cards that can help tell a story of not just the new baby, but the new parent too – and perhaps send a little SOS out into the world with a smile where there might otherwise be lonely meltdown. 

A chance to laugh with other parents in the solidarity of sleepless nights and s**tmageddons. Because the kids might be all kinds of wonderful, but the parents doing all the snot-wiping and tantrum negotiating on 3 hours of sleep and 4 cups of coffee are pretty fab too!

Listen in to hear Christina share:

  • An introduction to her and her businesses (1:15)
  • The inspiration for her parenting milestone cards and how she launched them in 3 weeks (1:40)
  • The process of creating her cards – and why who you know can help! (5:17)
  • How she got her first sales (7:44)
  • Some of the milestones on her cards (10:20)
  • How she expanded the range – by signing up with Not On The High Street (11:30)
  • The process of applying for NOTHS with a few top tips! (13:30)
  • How much time she spends on THIS MAMA DOES versus her main business – hint. It’s not a lot! (17:00)
  • Selling her cards wholesale and how she got her first orders (22:20)
  • Her number one piece of advice for other product creators (27:49)

USEFUL RESOURCES:

THIS MAMA DOES website

THIS MAMA DOES on Twitter

THIS MAMA DOES on Facebook

THIS MAMA DOES on Instagram

THIS MAMA DOES cards on Scribbler

LET’S CONNECT

Find me on Instagram

Work with me

Transcript

Selling products as a side business – with Christina Pickworth, THIS MAMA DOES

INTRO (:

Welcome to the Bring Your Product Ideas to Life podcast, practical advice and inspiration to help you create and sell your own physical products. He is your host Vicki Weinberg

Vicki Weinberg (:

Hi. So today's guest has a great story to tell her she feels her products as a side business. Day-to-day she is a film and TV agent, but she's had success selling her products based to retail and wholesale. She still sells on a lot on the high street in Scribbler on-line today. And in fact, her Christmas cards are in Scribbler stores nationwide couple of years ago. So I won't say anymore instead, I'd like to introduce you to Christina Pickworth Hi Christina hello. Good morning warning. Thank you so much for being here.

Christina Pickworth (:

Thank you for having me very excited to be on stage. Thank you.

Vicki Weinberg (:

So, can we start by you telling us a little bit about yourself and your business, and I know that you have your main business as well as THIS MAMA DOES so could you talk about them by for a bit Please yes.

Christina Pickworth (:

So I've been working in the film and television industry for a long time now, more than 15 years. And that's something that I, I still do is still my main business, but when I had my children, I don't know. I, I, I, I think has a, as a new mom, you can feel a bit invisible and everything is about the baby and the children. And while they are wonderful, you don't stop being a person in your own, right. Just because you become a mother and yeah, I just felt a little bit lost.

Christina Pickworth (:

And I think your perspective changes when you, when you have children. And my, my job in film and television has always been about storytelling, and I felt that my story was getting lost in, in all the motherhood stuff. So one day I'm I remember it was very tiring day. My eldest was two and a half. My youngest was about five months. We were potty training. He also had chicken pox. She wasn't sleeping. And I kind of sunk back on to the sofa, sort of four 50 MC two at the clock of thought, you know, is it too early to have a wine?

Christina Pickworth (:

And that was when I just kind of had a bit of a light bulb moment. And, you know, I had seen baby milestone card where, you know, you see your, your people on Facebook, post a picture of their baby with a card saying, you know, I did XYZ today. And maybe you think that was cute or maybe roll your eyes. And I just thought, what about me? What about my story? And I wanted to come up with that was for parents

and mothers initially, where you could just put a level SOS out into the world with a smile where they might otherwise be a bit of, a bit of a meltdown, to be honest, that was when I came up with my baby milestone

range, which isn't for the babies it's for the moms.

Vicki Weinberg (:

So that was when THIS, MAMA DOES started. Is that right? Is that the front of your first photo?

Christina Pickworth (:

That was my first idea. And I had the idea and I launched a three weeks later that night.

Vicki Weinberg (:

That's amazingly quick. So how did you get in that frame in those three weeks? What did you actually do is to come up with it? So you had this idea to actually be able to have something to sell free weeks later. What did you do?

Christina Pickworth (:

So I came up with the first few cards very easily. I, I don't know. I just went through it really. I think there is a lot to be said for taking your time and thinking things through and getting things. Absolutely perfect. But also, I think there's a lot to be said by just diving headfirst in and getting something done, getting some in going, I

came up with the name THIS MAMA DOES and yeah, I just sorta went for it. It just went for it. And I didn't know what was going to happen, how they'd be received, whether or not it'd be a flash in the pan or something bigger.

Christina Pickworth (:

But yeah, I just put myself out there and gave it a go. I don't know.

Vicki Weinberg (:

Great. I think there was a lot to be said for actually just getting out there and doing something because you can do and I'm sure. And I'm sure you have changed Find things all of that can be done, but you need, you just need to start somewhere don't you?

Christina Pickworth (:

Yeah. And, and actually in that first pack, I did change one card, but that's but otherwise, and I changed a tiny piece of the design I'm on later iterations of it, but otherwise it's exactly the same as it is as it's always been. So you, you can get it pretty pretty right. First time sometimes.

Vicki Weinberg (:

Yes, that's right there. That's amazing. And so practically, so let's go. So you buy it at all the cards I share them. So you write all of the text. What about things like design? Is that something you do as well? Or

Christina Pickworth (:

So I'm very lucky to have a husband who was a graphic designer. So he physically designs and everything, but to my instructions or not sometimes. And then, then it gets very frustrated with me because I'm like, could you just do it? Like I said, the first time. So yeah, he, he, you know, I don't know how to use the InDesign or in a thing. So he physically doesn't know me, but to quote from him instructions.

Vicki Weinberg (:

Wow. And that also explains how you be able to do it so quickly as well, actually, partly because you have someone there that's, that's very handy. And then so you'd like them who designs them and then did you just go and find a local principal or something to get them actually print it?

Christina Pickworth (:

Yeah. So he had print connections anyway. So from that point, and if you're getting up and running was very quick and easy and you know, that, that was lucky for me, you know, I didn't have to source fabric or factories or anything like that. So yeah, mine was a very, very easy products to get off the ground quickly.

Vicki Weinberg (:

Yeah. And I guess having sort of you having a Prince or your husband's or where the new and that sorta thing definitely helps. Yeah. I think it was fantastic. And how many, if you don't mind me asking, did you do like a big print run first of all? Or did you start quite small?

Christina Pickworth (:

That's a good question. I can't remember. I think I probably did a hundred packs. I think I probably did about a a hundred packs. You know, I didn't have any set up cash or other than paying for those, but yeah, just kind of went for it. I think, you know, it's always tricky, isn't it with currencies because there's always the balance of, you want to give it a go and you want to try something out, but equally things get very expensive if you don't order from a mini. So a a hundred was not very many really in the grand scheme of things, but it felt like a good starting point.

Vicki Weinberg (:

Right? Yeah. And that's why I think you're right. I mean, its not so many that you are going to have an end and then not be alive as well. So many you are going to have boxes of books of sitting around, but yet it's a good is I think it was a good quantity set of tests, wherever, you know, wherever that the idea is got legs and wherever we are going to sell. So how did you get those first sales there?

Christina Pickworth (:

And so as soon as I had the idea, I, and had to come up with a name, I started social media accounts and that was how I, I sold them and in the beginning and still mainly sell them to be honest, although not very salesy on my social media. I'm not very good at that, but yeah, just maybe through Instagram was how I, how I started selling. And it was, I think it was, it felt like it was easier to grow on social media back then than

it is now. I think it's, I think it can be a bit harder, but it, it seemed to do all right for me.

Christina Pickworth (:

So in those early days it was good.

Vicki Weinberg (:Oh, and that was:Christina Pickworth (:

So yes, that's right. Yeah. It was four years ago.

Vicki Weinberg (:

Yeah. I can't even think back like what social media was like back then. And I don't know about you. Like I can't even cost my mind back for years, but I'm not sure yet that it probably wasn't as busy as it is that I don't know. But I guess then you also a bit with disadvantages, did it work? Did you have an Instagram and shops and things then possibly not right away? No. Weren't any of those

Christina Pickworth (:

Kinds of gizmos and tools that then, I mean I'm a bit rubbish at it really. I don't really use any of those anyway, so I'm not sure I'm, I'm not sure that they would have made any difference to me at that point.

Vicki Weinberg (:

That's interesting. So do you have a website? I presume as well when I know you have one, I know you have a website because you have your blog on, on there as well.

Christina Pickworth (:

Yeah. I have a website and yeah. I mean, occasionally I'll put some things on Instagram now, but I'm I'm, I don't really push the, the sales, which I should do, but its all time, isn't it, it's all creating content and trying to make it interesting and relevant for your audience. So it's something that I can definitely be better at.

Vicki Weinberg (:

I'm assuming though, and this isn't an assumption. I don't know that it sounds like it's a source of funds where it possibly a lot, there was a lot of word of mouth are involved as well. So if somebody gets them, they post a picture on their Facebook and then somebody says, where did you get those? And then it goes from there.

Christina Pickworth (:

Yeah. I think that's a really true, they all are designed to be used on social media. So there's an actual, there certainly is a little bit of that, that they're sort of self advertising if you like.

Vicki Weinberg (:

Wow. That's amazing. And I actually, before we move on, can you tell us just for fun we like, and because I'm very curious, can you tell us about some of the milestones you've got on your cards?

Christina Pickworth (:

Yes. So, so in their baby range I have things, like I said, Jen I'm, which is always a popular one, sponsored by coffee two. These are the ones that are kind of, I always use the most, there was a baby for sale one, which is very tongue in cheek. We will have those moments where you just want to put your baby on E-bay because they want to stop crying. Not really sure of course, but you know what I mean? Yeah. All sorts really This and there's lots of Rangers now, so I'm different things at different stages of parenting. I have a daddy range and then I there's a pregnancy range.

Christina Pickworth (:

So I miss booze. That's a fun one on that. I, I didn't really enjoy being pregnant for lots of reasons, but I definitely missed my wine. What should I say?

Vicki Weinberg (:

Okay. So how did the Range expat and say, was it, were you coming up with new ideas or where people are sort of asking for the things, which way round did it come?

Christina Pickworth (:

So I, so I launched in the Mae and I did have some ideas for some other possible ranges, but it was actually not on the high street. That was the catalyst for me actually coming in, sitting down and coming up with the new ranges because I applied to them online. And initially I was actually knocked back. And the feedback that I had was the, you know, what, I only had one or two products and that's not enough to, for not on the high street. They don't need you to have a range of products. And so that really focused my mind into coming up with some others.

Christina Pickworth (:

So, and then I came up with the, well, now you're asking, I came up with the pregnancy range and the kid range, I think were the two that I came up with a and then I saw that they were advertising for a picture a day and I managed to get the last slot to go and pitch to them, which felt very serendipitous. And I went alone and I took my three Product and they signed me up within about three minutes, which was amazing. And they said that they would like me to do a daddy range.

Christina Pickworth (:

So, and I, I had had some ideas about doing that already, but it, it was them asking because there their main customers are women. So it makes sense because that's who is shopping. So, and the daddy Rangers, my

most popular best selling range or not in the high street.

Vicki Weinberg (:

That's amazing. And when you say about the pitch day, I almost asked the question, was it in person? Because of course now nothing's in person, but I'm assuming it was, you went along somewhere to meet them.

Christina Pickworth (:

It was, I went along to their offices and met someone roughly who signed me up straight away. All right.

Vicki Weinberg (:

Is that part of a fair process or can you just apply online it because I'll be honest. I don't know much about it, not on the highest rate. And I'd love to learn a little bit more about that from you if that's okay.

Christina Pickworth (:

Yes. So you can apply online and I think lots of people can be successful that we round that it wasn't a way for me, but at the picture that day is I think they do. I don't know how often they do that. Maybe twice a year or something. Obviously it would be different right now and maybe they won't continue with them going forward, but there is something nice about getting to see our products in person. I think if you're applying online, then one thing to consider is your range because they really do look for that. And they also love to kind of personalization options, which I don't have a budget, which they are, is a big part of their business.

Christina Pickworth (:

So things to consider if you're thinking about applying

Vicki Weinberg (:

And I guess as well, but it's the benefits of applying in-person whether it be, or, or maybe they did it online now, I don't know if it was also, I guess when you're writing an application that, you know, you need to include a character, how you word that as well, because they must get so many applications and because they can't see you or your product. Yeah. I guess that's something to really think about it before submitting.

Christina Pickworth (:

Yeah. And I, and I think even if you submit and you don't get in, then don't let that put you off because I didn't get it, put me off, you know, if the inside of a matter for four years now, so,

Vicki Weinberg (:

And it sounds like they gave you the first time as well, or are they where they do give you like a constructive reason why they weren't taking on your products? Cause you say, they said you didn't have a big enough range. So that sounds really positive as well, but at least they were willing to give you a reason and then you

then had something actionable where you can do, because you read it. If that was a channel, you really wanted to go for it. And at least you knew what you needed to do. Is that

Christina Pickworth (:

Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. And you know, if you, if you are in a position to ask to feedback, do you ask the feedback and you know, if Some, there might be some things where there's nothing you can do, you know, if there are saturated with that particular kind of product or something like that, then you know, that's unfortunate. But if there is something you can do, then do you listen to the feedback and see if you can change their mind?

Vicki Weinberg (:

And so how do you find Selling on the, on the high street? Is it a good channel for you? Is it somewhere that you'd recommend to others?

Christina Pickworth (:

Yeah. I mean, I always, I always, you know, kind of sell on there. I probably don't maximize everything that's available to me as a, not on the high street seller. They have all sorts of community groups for people local to you that are also not in the high street sellers. They also have various kind of information and tips and things that you can access, but I haven't really ever made the most of those, which I should know I shared, but there is just not enough hours in the day. And as you said at the start, and this is something that I do on the side, so, you know, it can be difficult to maximize your business when it's not your main.

Vicki Weinberg (:

Yeah, absolutely. So while we are on the subject of that, so how is sort of the split between your two businesses? So what sort of percentage wise?

Christina Pickworth (:

So I would say it's probably a, I don't know, like nine to 9% not THIS MAMA, DOES the biggest amount of THIS MAMA DOES that I do is my social media, which I've already said I don't sell very much, so much anymore, so yeah, not very much. I don't focus much attention on it really, which is a shame because I enjoy it. But yeah, I mean, I did, I did throw a bit more time behind it in the beginning, but I mean, I've always my, my main businesses, my own business as well.

Christina Pickworth (:

So I always work really long hours anyway, and you fit things in and you'll get stuff done, but yeah, now I'm not very much. So you have to kind of really what it is that you are going to spend your time on when I am going to do some THIS MAMA DOES stuff. Yeah. It's hard.

Vicki Weinberg (:

Yeah. It does sound like you've, you know, you put it in the work obviously to create your products and they are available to sell on and that we can talk about what about you say with them in a moment? So it sounds like If you, you know, the products or are there and they're, you know, you're selling them then presumably they know that you don't have to be putting in as much time as you did at the beginning anyway, because it sounds like, you know, you're set up on the various places. I'm the sales happen? I'm is that fair to say that you do, you probably don't need to spend as much time as you did in the beginning?

Christina Pickworth (:

Well, I mean, I think the more time you put it in, the more you sell is the reality, but you know, I just have to live with that. That's just the way it goes. That's just the way it goes. Yeah. And you know, when I do do a salesy post, you know, that helps sales. There's no two ways around it and I should do, I should do more, especially this year where finances are particularly bleak, but you can let, you can actually do what you can do. And then you'd just have to make your piece with that.

Vicki Weinberg (:

Got it. And I guess it was my appointment here is not to give yourself too much of a hard time for it because one of the things about having a product or a business that is good is that as once you get to a certain point, you can be making sales about doing too much. And of course, to your point, if you decide to put in a bit more effort, whether that's with your marketing or social media, then your sales will go up. But if you haven't got the time to do that, hopefully you've still reached like a base level where it's, you know, it still worth having the business, it still taking over. You don't necessarily need to work on it every single day.

Christina Pickworth (:

Yeah. And I think, I think you're completely right, because then it becomes more of a passive income stream and that space at all, income streams are good, you know, and that can go up and down, but if it's a way to work happening, even if it's more down than up.

Vicki Weinberg (:

So it sounds like that, like you enjoy this as well, which I think is another, another, another reason to do something it's as if you enjoy creating the products and then you know, why not?

Christina Pickworth (:

Yeah. I mean, I think I've really enjoyed the social media don't know I was quite late to Instagram. I kind of had started on Instagram just, just before I came up with the idea and I kind of wished I'd done it earlier because it makes complete sense for me and my background, my story telling background, because it, it is basically the words and pictures and I love that about it, but yeah, I don't know. I think it, for me, it's, it is fun and it has opened up my life to of other possibilities that I wouldn't have had.

Christina Pickworth (:

And I started out at a moment where I felt very lonely and lost as a new mom. And I really think it, it helps me so much in that respect that it, it's kind of a thing that if I never sold another product, then it, its done so much more for me than just being about the products in the sales.

Vicki Weinberg (:

Oh, that was amazing. And by the way, I think your Instagram's brilliant because it was just, yeah, I like it. So lighthearted and fun. And is it really nice to come to the fall? I said I will link to it in the show notes because I think everyone would go and look at Christina as an Instagram account because it's just, yeah, it was a happy place.

Christina Pickworth (:

Oh, thank you. Thank you. I know I tried to be happy sometimes. I'll not always, but I'm always honest and I think that's why that's important.

Vicki Weinberg (:

Yeah, I think so. And I think, I think you have both, but I think, yeah, even when things are our hearts, I don't know if there's something about just, I don't know if you can see things can be hard and you can be honest, but still be kind of what's the right word. Just, it just, I don't know, like maybe even when it comes to a happy, does that make sense? Yes, absolutely. And I think that's really, I think that's a really nice if we all need a bit of positivity or online at the moment, don't we? Yeah. Anyway, that was a bit of a, that was a digressed inside of me to have on-site. So let's go back to your products and talk a bit more about where you sell them other than not on the high street, because I know that you've mentioned that you've sold wholesale as well as directly to customers.

Vicki Weinberg (:

So I'd be interested just to talk about that and how that came about Please

Christina Pickworth (:

Yes. So the way that I, I launched doing wholesale really was through a trade show. So I I think this would have been the trade show. You the first trade show I did was pulse, which now it doesn't happen anymore. Or its sort of being absorbed by a top drawer and a but I was in there. The source of the new maker is a section of pulse. And the year that I did that pulse was in may and also to sell my business and may. So I think it was when I was one-year-old what is the world?

Christina Pickworth (:

And yeah, I, I don't know. I know it's nerve wracking doing trade shows because they cost a really big chunk of money and you don't know how they're gonna go, but I, again, I just went for it, decided to give it a try and it went pretty well actually. I mean, it's, it can be quite difficult with trade shows because you know, you get, you'll get hopefully sale while you're there, but also hopefully more sales after it. And the first that was the

first one I did. I've done a couple now and yeah, I got loads of, I've got loads of wholesale orders and it was a really good experience for me.

Vicki Weinberg (:

So you mentioned that Scribbler were one of the places that were selling your products, is that right? So yeah.

Christina Pickworth (:

How did you, yeah, so tell me that. Well, they say that that first trade show was when they first sort of became aware of me. And then it was when I did my next trade show, which was top drawer that they can sort of came around to see me again. And it was after it was off the back of that one that they all did my Christmas cards for their shops.

Vicki Weinberg (:

Oh, okay. So that, wasn't going to be my question. I was going to ask what came first, the Scribbler or the Christmas cards. So you'd already been selling Christmas cards at that point.

Christina Pickworth (:

So yeah, so I had, so that was top drawer, which was in the January. I don't know what year that was. It was a couple of years ago now. So I had done some Christmas cards and launched them and sold them in the December prior to that top drawer. And then the top drawer on January, they saw them and loved them and it, and it takes the ordering process can take a while. So I think it wasn't until sort of July or August that they actually ordered them. But that was off the back of that, that top drawer.

Vicki Weinberg (:

That was amazing. So the festival you are selling them yourself and be like, yeah. Okay. And so where are you still selling? We have Scribbler now as well, or are they still taking the wholesale orders?

Christina Pickworth (:

So they, so I'm still selling online. Their business model has changed a little bit. So they're made me focus on online, but yet you can still buy my Christmas cards and I have a couple of other cards on, on the online site. So just search for THIS MAMA DOES and there I am.

Vicki Weinberg (:

Yeah. Or I'll put a link to that as well. So people can find it super easily if they want to go and have a look at your Christmas cards or so this episode will be going out in January. So it might be late or maybe people can stick up for Christmas 20, 21. Okay. So how do you sell your products anyway? So other than this, on the high Street and Selling to wholesale, do you sell anywhere else? Any other marketplaces?

Christina Pickworth (:

Yes. So I sell them on Uber. I'm a MAMA, which is a market place for a parent run businesses. So if you're looking to support parents with their own businesses, then it's a great place to check out all sorts of lovely stuff on there.

Vicki Weinberg (:

No, thank you. I sell that to Actually. I think it's a really nice marketplace and a really lovely community as a seller as well. So I think if you're a parent and you sell products, it's a really nice place to look up to you.

Christina Pickworth (:

Yeah. It is a really big kind of a aspect to it. So definitely one to check out if you're, as we say, if you're a seller or also if you are a customer do check act because you know that you are, you're contributing to the family basically by buying it from there.

Vicki Weinberg (:just for context in November,:Christina Pickworth (:

Yeah, absolutely. But you know, it's not always possible to support small businesses, but when you can, it's a really important,

Vicki Weinberg (:

Okay. Well thank you so much because they, you know, I've got one final question before we finish up, if that's okay. Which is what would your top advice be to someone else looking to start selling their own products and perhaps particularly someone maybe who is, who has a business or has a job and wants to, you know, wants to do something on the side. Because I think I've, as I said, we haven't had anyone on in that situation as yet. And I, but I know plenty of people who, who were kind of inspired, but perhaps a little bit put off by the fact they have a day job or they have another business. So I'd love for you to talk so that if that's okay.

Christina Pickworth (:

Yeah. I think really you just, if there's something that you want to do, just go for it, give her a try, you know, or maybe it won't work or maybe it will maybe its something that can sit along side, whatever you're doing or maybe it will overtake or whatever else it is that you are doing, but you can make those decisions and decide how it can serve you in the best way. And that might be just in that. It, it's just a little extra thing that you do because you love it. And you know, it likes you are in some way equally, or you might decide that it's too

hard and too much work and it doesn't sit alongside of the things, but at least you've done it then.

Christina Pickworth (:

And you know, and it's not that thing of, Oh, I wish I'd given that a whirl. Just give it a try or do what you can do. Don't beat yourself up about how much time you're able to dedicate to it. Certainly don't compare yourself to other businesses because I think that's something that can be easy to do, but you've just got to remember if it's a side hustle, it's a side hustle, you know, you can't look at other people that are perhaps spending loads of money on PR or marketing or social media or you know, product development and think, Oh, you know, they're doing a much better than me.

Christina Pickworth (:

They're just doing something different to you. So I think you just have to go for it, to stay in your own lane and do it because you love it. And if you don't know of it, then just don't do it anymore. That's that's that? I think that that's what you can do real isn't it, it, you know, just give it a go and see where you end up with it.

Vicki Weinberg (:

I think that's brilliant advice. Thank you. And I also think that if I think that there's also a, sort of a lot of pressure to have, you know, a side business side hustles, but actually you can just do it for fun. And of course, you know, hopefully you going to make some money, but it doesn't ever have to be a fully fledged business. It doesn't ever have to be a part time business, let alone a full time business. Yeah. I think that if you've got the passion to do it, it yes. Do it and, and, and enjoy doing it. And perhaps, you know, it, it doesn't matter if you don't want it to be, as I say, a, a huge business or even a small business, if you just do it for the fun of it,

Christina Pickworth (:

I think that's exactly right. I think you just have to work out what it is you want to do. There is, you know, perhaps it's a creative outlet that, that you need to, or perhaps its, you know, for us an extra, a little income stream, just figuring out why is that you want to do it. And then as long as it's serving wherever that need is then great.

Vicki Weinberg (:

That's brilliant. Thank you. And thank you so much for everything you shared that I found your story really interesting. And I think that other people will as well because yeah, it's, it's, it's really nice to hear that. Even though you did this as a sort of a, as a small business, it seems like, you know, you've done some big things. Yeah. I think it's really inspiring. So thank you.

Christina Pickworth (:

Thank you so much for having me. It's always nice to have a little reflect on the journey as well for me from my point of view. So it's been really fun chatting,

Vicki Weinberg (:

Are you okay? I might have to say that I'm really struck by the fact that you say that you don't spend much time on it, but when you look at everything that you've done and we, you shared a vast, you've done a lot. So yeah. I'm pleased that you are able to reflect on that because you don't sell yourself short. I think you've done an incredible amount.

Christina Pickworth (:

Thank you. Thank you. So I think when you're inside it, it doesn't always feel like it, but yeah, it's be nice to, to think. Oh yeah, I know I have. I have done some, some pretty cool stuff all along the way. I will. Thank you so much. Thank you for having me. It's been my pleasure.

Vicki Weinberg (:

Hi, thank you so much for listening as always. I'd absolutely love to know what your thought on this episode, please. Do you remember to rate and review the show and also most importantly subscribed so you don't miss out in any future episodes. And as a reminder, I release a new episode every single Friday. So take care of, and forward to speaking to you again, then.