How to launch a lingerie brand – with Tiffany Chiu – JulieMay Lingerie

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Welcome to the Bring Your Product Idea to Life podcast. This is the podcast for you if you're getting started selling products, or if you'd like to create your own product to sell. I'm Vicki Weinberg, product creation coach and Amazon expert. Every week I share friendly, practical advice as well as inspirational stories from small businesses. Let's get started.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:00:24

Today I'm speaking with Tiffany from Julie May Lingerie. JulieMay Lingerie's only underwear brand tested by dermatologists and certified by allergy free UK to be friendly for people with sensitive skin. Everything is made with certified organic Pima. I had a great conversation with Tiffany. As you can imagine at the outset, I knew absolutely nothing about creating lingerie brands. Um, I know a lot more now. It was really interesting hearing what motivated Tiffany to start her business in the first place. All the steps that she has to go through to create her lingerie. Um, she spoke about the way she chose to launch her brand, which I found really interesting. And all the success and the awards and things that have come since. Um, and it's such a new business as well. So I found the whole story really fascinating and I would love now to introduce you to Tiffany. So, hi Tiffany. Thank you so much for being here.

Tiffany: 00:01:17

Hi Vicki. Uh, it's lovely to be here. Uh, I'm Tiffany. Let me introduce a bit about myself and my business. So my business is called JulieMay Lingerie. Uh, as nowadays, people are getting more cautious of the material they're wearing against their skin. And our underwear is the UK's only allergy friendly underwear, brands that make of certified organic Pima cotton and is anti allergy. And it helps people, uh, with, uh, skin issues, sensitive skins, or we have many customer that are allergic to material like latex, synthetic fibres and elastin. Yeah.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:02:00

Oh, that's brilliant. Oh, thank you for explaining. And um, so does allergy free, is that all about the material you you use then? So are there certain, so you've just, I guess you, you mentioned, um, like latex earlier. So are there certain materials that are classified as allergy free? Is that how it works?

Tiffany: 00:02:17

Yes. Yes. Mainly because of the, uh, material that triggers the allergies. Uh, we, we see like the most common allergies are like latex in that, or nickels. Many people are allergic to, uh, the nickels of the underwear of the bras or like the metal, um, fastening or like harsh chemicals in, uh, polyesters. And we also have customer, not like, um, we have skin allergy, but just general sensitive skins, for example, due to menopause or after their post-surgery or, uh, sorry, after their breast surgeries. And they need something really soft and smooth that can touch the skin.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:03:06

Oh, that's brilliant. Thank you for explaining. And what inspired you to start creating your bras?

Tiffany: 00:03:12

Um, yeah. Well, I started the brand a few years ago because when my mum gave birth to my little sisters and she developed rashes on her, on her breast, and I started to look, uh, on the market and realized that there's no. Uh, there's no relief for her situations. So I start to look into the market. I realized there's a huge gap in the market, and then I do some research and the materials, and that's how I started it.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:03:42

Amazing. And I'm, I'm really surprised. And were you surprised to find that there was nothing on the market already at that time?

Tiffany: 00:03:51

Uh, yes. I, I guess it's because when people have certain type of, like skin conditions or we've seen, um, customer who have, uh, rashes between, uh, their breasts due to like, because they have a bigger, bigger breast, or they tend to have sweats underneath their boobs or between them and they don't realize that it's caused by, uh, the clothing that they're wearing or they didn't realize that they can do something about it by changing their underwear. So I guess that's why, but, uh, since we started a brand many, uh, many people are getting more, uh, educated about, uh, the material that used in underwear can cause certain type of allergic uh, conditions. So they start to find a solution from us.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:04:47

That makes total sense because I've seen a lot of information out there. You know, like if your bra is maybe uncomfortable, I, I've seen information in the past about things like, um, uh, you know, change your washing powder. Maybe your washing powder is irritating. But there hasn't been a lot of information that I've seen about the actual fabric, but of course that makes sense, that rather than looking, maybe changing your washing powder or whatever, thinking about the fabric you're putting next to your skin, does makes so much sense, doesn't it?

Tiffany: 00:05:16

Yes, it is. We went to an allergy free show in London a few months ago, and when people walk by and see us, saw our stand, and they were like, oh, I've never heard such thing as like allergy friendly underwear before. And they find it kind of weird why you're here. But once we kind of explain the concept to them, they feel like, oh, that makes like, uh, that actually makes sense why I haven't thought of that before. So, yeah.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:05:42

Yeah, it really does. Um, and so when your mum started wearing your underwear, did she see an improvement in her condition?

Tiffany: 00:05:49

Yes, of course. Um, because, um, all our products have been, uh, tested by dermatologists and certified by allergy for uk. And we do see, uh, not only improvement in my mum's condition, but many of our customer's condition. So now, not only by mum, myself and my little sister, wearing my underwear, uh, like underwear brand. So, yeah.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:06:14

That's amazing. And I'm just so impressed that your mum had this issue and you just went and created something. I'm just, I'm blown away by that, that you were able, she must have been so, um, so grateful that you, that you did. Because it must be a huge undertake. And I've got so many questions about how you actually develop an underwear range. Um, so can you take us back to say, you know, you decided that you would like to look into this. There was nothing on the market. What did you do next? What was the first step in actually creating your range of products?

Tiffany: 00:06:44

The first step that I did was build a minimal viable product, so, I just have one simple collection or like one simple set and then I start selling online. I don't get much sales, uh, uh, back in that time, but every sale, uh, means a lot to me and I talk to customers and listen carefully to what they want, and I kind of like, uh, spent all my time researching the best fabric combinations based on their feedback and source the material that will not trigger any irritation to the skin. So I kind of am moving my collections based on what customer told me.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:07:33

Okay. That makes sense. So what, what material was your first, so your first was your first product, was it simply one bra that you created in a range of sizes?

Tiffany: 00:07:41

Yes. Just, it was just one set.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:07:43

Yeah, one set. And what fabric did you use for that initial set? I'm just being curious.

Tiffany: 00:07:49

I, I use, uh, cotton and then after I talk to a customer, they told me, uh, which part they feel as irritating the skin. For example, one customer told me that they feel the bra they're wearing is really hot. And make them sweat. So I kind of think, oh, maybe I could put silk in the, in the layers to cool down the skin, especially when I have, um, I have customer that have eczema and sweating really make the condition worse. So I kind of. Uh, try different materials. I also have customer told me that they find issues with the straps that sticking in and rubbing it against the skin. So I changed the, uh, sewing technique of the straps to make the straps comfortable. So that's how I, um, develop my collection. Like, um, I improve it every time when I hear from my customer.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:08:50

That's amazing. And out of interest. Do you have any experience in fashion or textiles or anything like that?

Tiffany: 00:08:57

Not really. I, I was in a law background, so, uh, funny enough, I don't have any experience in design or in fashion or textile, but once I decided to start the brand, I took, uh, design course, um, from the UAL. So kind of like educate myself more about like bra designing. So yeah.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:09:24

That's really impressive. Because I think a lot of people are put off by doing something because they say, oh, I don't have experience. So I think it's fantastic that you just said, okay, I don't have the experience, but I can learn.

Tiffany: 00:09:34

Mm-hmm.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:09:35

Um, did you work with bra designers to come up with the designs or was that something you were able to do yourself?

Tiffany: 00:09:41

Uh, when I first start the business, because I only have one set, so I just, uh, did it myself. But now I have a bigger collection and I have new collection launching every year. And I'm starting to work with professional, uh, lingerie designer now.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:09:59

Oh, that's brilliant. And how about the production side? So, uh, initially did you just have to, I say just because I know you're finding a supply is not an easy thing, but was it a case of finding, um, a factory that could make what you wanted in the fact, in the fabric that you were looking at?

Tiffany: 00:10:15

Uh, yeah, because mm, not only I want my collections to be, um, allergy friendly and suitable for sensitive skins, I also want my collection to be ethically made. So I have to find, um, a factory that can, uh, produce my bras, um, like ethically. So it, it is difficult, but once you have find the factory and build that relationship. It, yeah, I guess it's, yeah. Or, or, or you can actually go to a lot of, um, associations online that can help you to connect with a supplier and help you to yeah. Produce your collection. So, yeah.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:11:07

I think you're right. Finding this flow isn't necessarily that straightforward, but it is worth it, isn't it, to find someone that you are happy with and you enjoy working with because you don't want to be doing the same process again and again. Um, it's good to just build up a relationship if that works long term.

Tiffany: 00:11:22

Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:11:24

And I guess then they get to know you more and know what you're looking for, and they're able to support you.

Tiffany: 00:11:29

Yeah, it's all about like the communications that you have between you, your designer, and the suppliers. When you get that communications and get the relationship established, I think everything can go smoothly.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:11:44

And tell about, um, sorry to ask you so many questions, but I've never spoken to anyone with a lingerie brand before. So I do have questions. I hope you don't mind. So one thing I was gonna ask about is sizing. So for lingerie, is there like standard sizes that you would say to the factory, make this size, this size, this size and, and the factory knows like there's a universal standard. The reason I ask this is because I've spoken to clothing brands before who've said for clothing, so they say T-shirt. It can be quite hard because as we know, different stores work to different measurements and it's not really standard. But for, for lingerie, is everything. Can you see what I mean? Is there universal?

Tiffany: 00:12:23

Yes.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:12:23

Accepted. This is the size?

Tiffany: 00:12:26

I, well, I think you've touched a really, really difficult questions in the lingerie industry because bra sizing is not always easy. Yeah. Especially when we sell online, sometimes it could be really difficult to find the right size, and I don't think that such things called like standard sizing because different bra shapes fit differently and especially with the material that we use are so different. The stretch, the, uh, flexibilities are different. So it, it really, it really depends. I don't think there's such things called like sensitizing even that you, for example, if you buy a 36 D from Marks and Spencer and you'll find yourself end up with a completely different size in a different brand.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:13:23

Wow. That's a real, that's a real challenge. How did, how did you, um, overcome that? What was your approach?

Tiffany: 00:13:30

Well, just to provide as much information as possible online to help our customer to find the right size. Uh, give really, really detailed size guide and size chart and help our customer to, um, take measure themself before purchase.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:13:49

Yeah, that makes sense. And I think you're right though. I think customers are used now too, but when they buy from a different brand or maybe a brand they haven't brought from before, whether it's underwear or clothing, you do sort of know that the size may not be what you are used to because as you say, they just aren't standard. I wasn't sure for underwear, I knew for clothes they weren't, I wasn't sure for bras. Um, but I think most consumers know, don't they, that they need to, um, take measurements and make sure they're getting the correct, the correct size and fit.

Tiffany: 00:14:18

And one thing that's very important when you do a lingerie business is to ensure that you have a good return and exchange process because people tend have to like try a few times in order to get the perfect fit.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:14:34

That's really useful. So do you find that customers will, um, maybe order a range of sizes from you and then return the ones that aren't right?

Tiffany: 00:14:42

Yeah, sometimes they do. Yes.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:14:44

Yeah, that's really, that's a really good point about the exchange and refund process. Um, I wouldn't have thought of. That's fantastic. Um, and so you mentioned that your ranges expanded due to feedback from your customers.

Tiffany: 00:14:56

Mm-hmm.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:14:56

So talk us through the last couple of years. So you started off with just. Um, the one initial set and, um, talk us through what's happened since and how your range looks now. I know that's a big question.

Tiffany: 00:15:10

No, like, um, well, I think the brands, uh, the brand is growing very quickly and has made a lot of achievement in the past few years when we have expand our collections and go to the market. Uh, the brand's been featured in Guardian Evening Standard, and we won the London Prestige Award, the best Lingerie store of the year. We have also been selected as one of the a hundred most inspiring small firms. And we have awarded the new promising, uh, sorry, the most promising business of the year by the Kent, uh, Chamber of Commerce. So the brands has make a lot of achievement and progress so far.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:15:59

That's amazing. And how have the, the awards, you've mentioned some of these awards that you've won, which is fantastic by the way. Congratulations. I think that's a massive achievement because you're still quite a young business. How have, um, the awards that you've won and the recognition you've had, has that impacted your business at all?

Tiffany: 00:16:14

Yes, of course. Um, well, I'm very honoured that, uh, my effort and my team and the business has been recognized by this award and this award can, um, help my brand to get the exposure and, um. And one thing is when you fill out the application for all this award, you kind of have a better understanding of what, where you are now and where you want to go next. So it is overall is a very wonderful, um, experience, uh, in applying awards and also very exciting to win those awards.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:17:05

That makes sense. Um, okay. Because I guess while you are filling out the application, you have to think a lot about what your brand is and the message you want to share. Um, so I guess you really hone that message while you are doing that.

Tiffany: 00:17:17

Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:17:19

And, um, how did you choose? I mean, uh, if maybe you, if you've got any advice around this sort of choosing which awards to enter? Because of course, as we all know, there are so many awards. Quite often I get something in my inbox or I see on social media. Um, how did you go about deciding which ones you were going to enter? Because presumably you could spend a lot of time filling out forms. Um, so was there any strategy behind the ones you went for?

Tiffany: 00:17:44

Uh, I guess to find, I guess you can start searching from local awards. Yeah. For example, we have won the, uh, SSP award in the southeast England and also like the um, award from the Kent in the Chamber of Commerce because we're based in Kent. So maybe we can start, um, locally and start to search local awards because local awards can help. You could connect with other, like local business owners and they kind of build community around all the award winners. And then you can start going for national awards, for example. I'm one of the winners of the Young Innovator Award this year. This is a government funded award, um, um, organized by the Innovate UK. And, uh, going nationally could mean like, um, more recognitions, more resources and more opportunities, but also of course, it's harder and more difficult. So my advice is to, uh, start searching for local and start locally.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:18:59

That makes so much sense. And I guess then you can make sure that your messaging is correct, how you position your brand. And I guess once you've had some success with the local awards, then you can, as you say, think about applying for the national ones.

Tiffany: 00:19:11

Mm-hmm.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:19:12

Um, and I guess it also gives you a bit of confidence as well if you've won a few awards, because I think it must be very intimidating to, um. And, well, I'm speaking for myself. Maybe you don't find it intimidating, but I feel it. It could possibly be quite intimidating to go put yourself up for Big National Awards as a very young brand.

Tiffany: 00:19:32

Yeah. But try to think of another way, like another perspective, not thinking, um, as a competition. But thinking it as an opportunity to, for example, to, uh, outline a business plan. So, um, change, kind of like make you feel less stressful about feeling it. Um, Filling in, um, com competitions or filling in the applications because do you, you just don't think it as competition. Just think it as like a exercise to build your business strategy and don't, don't be too stressful about like winning it or not.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:20:17

That makes a lot of sense. Thank you. I really like that advice. Mm-hmm. Um, yeah, that's, that's really good because you're right that it can't all be about the, you know, we're not all going to win everything.

Tiffany: 00:20:27

Yeah.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:20:29

So that's really useful. And, um, I guess as well as another benefit of winning the awards is a lots more people finding you now, because what I've been reflecting on as we've been speaking, as you mentioned, but there weren't, there wasn't any underwear or lingerie brands that was allergy free in the first place. So now you've got an allergy free brand. I guess there's also some education of customers that actually you can, you know, perhaps some of your skin issues might be due to the underwear you're wearing. And even if not for things like menopause, as you were saying, choosing different underwear can help you with symptoms. Um, so how have you been getting that message out? Because I think it's always hard when you are the first to do something because you are almost leading the way with speaking about it.

Tiffany: 00:21:13

Yeah, I, I think, uh, the message that you have to, you trying to give out has to be precise. Yeah. You can't include everything in your brand. You have to find, uh, unique selling points of your brand. And the values behind your brand are what values you can offer to your customer and emphasize that one particular value, uh, many, many times on, on your public speaking, on your websites, on your blog, or on your social media. Yeah.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:21:56

Yeah, that makes sense. And I think you've done a great job of that. When I look at your website, you know, I get a real sense of who your lingerie is for. Well I know it's for everyone, but, um, I think you do a great job of explaining the benefits.

Tiffany: 00:22:07

Yeah. Thank you.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:22:09

And I've got another questions where, if you don't mind, about the, um, you mentioned that your lingerie is certified allergy free. So is that a process you need to go through in order to have that certification? Was there something you, you had to do?

Tiffany: 00:22:23

Yeah. Uh, first of all, we have to take the products to lab for testing. So we have a laboratory testing, uh, to say that there's no harsh chemicals found in the report, and, and then you have to, um, kind of, um, prove, give evidence to prove your claims uh, to apply for this certifications. I guess the process is the same, uh, for other certifications as well.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:23:01

That makes sense. And does the, um, having this certification, and sorry to ask so many questions, but I'm genuinely so interested, does, does it kind of impact anything about your product? So for example, um, because of the chemical aspect, are there only, this might be a really stupid question, but I'm going to ask it anyway just in case anyone else thinks it, like, are there a certain. Only certain lingerie colours you're able to do because of obviously the chemicals involved in dyeing processes or, um, do you tend to steer away from that anyway? How does that, what I'm trying to ask is, does um, being certified allergy free, does it impact at all on the designs and what you are able to do with your lingerie? If that makes sense.

Tiffany: 00:23:40

Yes. It's actually, um, kind of limit what we can do. Like you said, we can't use, like, for example, synthetic lasers, we have to use cotton lasers. We have to use cotton threads and we can't, we just can't do like, um, we can do some designs. That we really want, uh, because we have to use a certain type of material and avoid using some other materials. So that is limitation when you create the allergy friendly collections. But I think we manage it quite well to maintain, uh, the comfortability of the collections and the, um, and also make it beautiful and elegant, not just like boring plain collections.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:24:37

Yeah, I agree. I think your underwear's really pretty. Um, and I would say that looking at it and not knowing the background, you wouldn't necessarily say this is allergy free, or this is different from any other lingerie brand in terms of, you know, the aesthetic. It looks really pretty.

Tiffany: 00:24:52

Mm-hmm. Yeah. Thank you.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:24:55

And I guess in some ways as well, it's nice to have those parameters if you need to know what you can and can't, um, do and include, I guess that, does that help with the design process in some ways because, um, it's very clear.

Tiffany: 00:25:11

Um, I wouldn't say it helps or not helping, it's just the direction that your designs have to go. It's like there this kind of like a limitation around. What you can design, what you can or what materials you can use and what things that you can't use. So.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:25:34

Yeah, that makes, that makes sense. I guess it is what it is. It's one of those things.

Tiffany: 00:25:39

Yes.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:25:41

Well, thank you so much for everything you have shared Tiffany. I have one final question, if that's okay, which is what would your number one piece of advice be for other product creators?

Tiffany: 00:25:51

Uh, my number p one piece of advice is to listen to your customer. I think it is very tempting to design the product that you think is the best, but without testing it with, in the market. So I think it's, uh, always helpful to design the collections and listen what customer says. Before you get like, um, you get a big inventory or before you buy a lot from the supplier. So make sure you start small and then listen to what the customer says. I'm sure after you listen to your customer feedback, you'll find there are so many upgrades that you want to do with your products. So make sure you do all this, like, um, uh, all this feedback loop before you ordering in bulk from the supplier.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:26:53

That makes loads of sense. Thank you. Because I think it can be really tempting, particularly if you've, came up with the idea, or I guess in your case you came with the idea to help your mum.

Tiffany: 00:27:01

Mm-hmm.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:27:01

It can be really easy to have a really narrow focus and just think of what you like or what the person you are creating the product for would like. Um, and forgetting that actually this needs to, for it to be a business, it needs to work and appeal to much wide, wider range of people.

Tiffany: 00:27:18

Yeah, exactly. It's just, make sure that the product you design, not only you like about it or your friends or family, like about it, make sure that your customer, the peoples who actually buying it, likes it.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:27:32

Brilliant advice. Thank you so much, Tiffany.

Tiffany: 00:27:34

You're welcome. Thank you so much for inviting me. I'm happy to share my story and I hope, uh, yeah, uh, you find it helpful.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:27:44

It's, it's been fascinating. Thank you so much. I've really enjoyed this. Thank you.

Tiffany: 00:27:48

You're welcome.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:27:50

Thank you so much for listening right to the end of this episode. Do remember that You can get the full back catalogue and lots of free resources on my website, vickiweinberg.com. Please do remember to rate and review this episode if you've enjoyed it, and also share it with a friend who you think might find it useful. Thank you again and see you next week.