Creating and selling products you love – with Kate Towers

INTRO: 00:00:08

Welcome to the, bring your product ideas to life podcast, practical advice, and inspiration to help you create and sell your own physical products. Here's your host Vicki Weinberg.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:00:22

Kate Towers designs and creates colorful feel-good prints cards and homeware, wear helping bring colour into people's lives. I am so please have Kate on the podcast. We've been trying to arrange this for a while an hour and I'm delighted that she's joining us because I love her work and everything that she does. I'm a big fan of color. So hi Kate, and thank you for being yeah.

Kate Towers: 00:00:41

Hello. Thank you for having me on your podcast. I'm excited to be here.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:00:46

Oh, you're really welcome. Thank you for coming on. So I've obviously given you a little introduction, Kate, but would you like to introduce yourself and your business and talk a bit more about what it is that you created.

Kate Towers: 00:00:57

Yeah. So I'm Kate towers, the founder of Kate towers design. So it's really a colorful business, helping people live life in Fu full color. So I, as you said, I design, I create artwork prints, cots, homeware, which in case feel good cushions and gift wrap and a whole host of things. And it really came about after the birth of my second child, I suffered with postnatal depression, and I really found that the use of color and feel good quotes really helped me. So I I've always been interested in art from a very early on. So I thought I would start kind of design and putting some of my ideas down. And then it really developed from there. Although I've been doing this for five years. I haven't really dedicated a lot of time to it. You know, there are life things get in the way a full full-time job, kids, family. So I took the decision. Yeah. To launch in March this year and dedicate more of my time to my passion. So I was working full time in London and I decided to take voluntary redundancy, which was super scary especially in the climate that we're in. But it's definitely a now never moment for me. And I think I really saw a change once I'd done that and I could dedicate. The maximum amount of time to my business.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:02:43

Yeah, thank you. And thank you for all of that background, but most of which I knew nothing about, so thank you so much for sharing. And yeah, and you can sort of, you really get a sense of like how much joy you're creating your products gives you really comes across when you like, look at what you do with like the joy and the happiness really does come across there. So you said you'd never really been that interested in art. I'm really interested to know sort of how you learn all of the skills that you have, because I look at you and your sort of doing it. Digital design, if that's what it's even called K and making cushions. And how, how did you learn to do what.

Kate Towers: 00:03:18

Yeah. So so secondary school. So I studied art and textiles then went on to do a levels. I then went on to Camberwell art college, but really found it wasn't for me. It was kind of a different style of art and it just wasn't what I was looking for. And so then I went straight into retail which actually helped me develop my love of cards and gift wrap. And I then through my retail career, I then joined a charity and I was working for them on their retail side. And I was there for around 17 years. And then I started designing on the side. And then my role within that charity developed into producing cards and catalogs and design work. And it was something where I really found my passion and this is why I wanted to do this side. I absolutely loved. So I bought myself an iPad pro, which was cool. Hefty investment, but I've never looked back. It's one of the best things I've bought. I use a tool and a program called procreate, which allows you to produce digital art. I still paint in my free time. When I was on when I was with my, my, my job that was in London, I was furloughed only for about a month and I. I'm going to take a course in sewing, just because I'm really interested in it. And, you know, I watch people on the tele and I think it's just, you know, such a scale. So I took a local sewing course, which then you know, I'm not the best. So but it really allowed me to develop kind of like the homeware range. And then I started, did you sleep print fabric? And it really started from there. And it was definitely, I think the design inside for me is definitely where my passion lies. Yeah, I see you say more say than the actual serving of a great insight. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I do like it, but I think when you soak the 15th cushion, it can be a bit mundane. So I think I get all my excitement from kind of like when I designed with color and you know, where I'm influenced and things and looking at kind of like create a mood boards before. Design a range. So yeah, I think it's definitely the more interesting side for me. Yeah. That makes sense.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:05:55

And you were still talking about digitally printing fabric. Is that something you actually do yourself?

Kate Towers: 00:06:00

No. No. So I have a supply. The I send my digital artwork T and they will print fabric and then I'll wear my cap into products, but I've just started working with a new supplier where I just produce the artwork and they actually make the products. So that can be a bit more expensive, but You know, as long as you've got the quality, it can be amazing. And I've just had some samples back, which are absolutely fantastic. And I just done a local art fair and have some great responses to them. So I think sometimes it's a bit of like trial and error and testing supplies and things like that. So I think you have to look at what you can do, but also, you know, if you can outsource it. That makes sense. Especially as you said, you don't particularly enjoy the sobbing and I guess the only way for you to sort of produce more cushions that say, as an example is to outsource it. If it's something you, you know, you don't want to be so unfair to Christians today or whatever it would be, I guess it's yeah.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:07:02

Outsourcing so way to do that. And how did you go about finding suppliers? I was wondering this, when you were talking about the cards and rapid pay for and things like that, did you have some contacts and when you were working in the charity doing something similar or have you had to go and find all of these suppliers yourself?

Kate Towers: 00:07:18

Yeah. So I did have some contacts but as we stay print, like thousands of cards, every prem run obviously I'm not doing. I'm starting a lot smaller. So I did actually look a lot more local. So I think it's really looking at what's in the local area and maybe trying to work with some of the businesses, especially if you're going to be a repeat customer, you can get some really good deals. I also I just, I kind of, I just use Google on a lot of them for printing fabric, for instance. And then what I done is just done a comparison with a few sites to see what maybe would be the best or some samples looking at the quality. So yeah, I really think it's, it's kind of just seeing what's on the market. There's so many things out there now. I think. You know, these wonderful suppliers that can produce, you know, prints and cards and, you know, I've seen wallpapers and gosh, I would love to do that, but I need to just do one thing at a time. Yeah, there's lots of great companies out there and I would definitely recommend looking locally as well. Cause sometimes you get the better discount.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:08:24

Yeah, that makes sense. And I love how non phased you seem about it as well. Cause I know that finding suppliers can be something that people can get quite concerned about. And it seems like a massive thing. I love the way you're saying this, you know, you, it sounds like you just went and did it, which is I think fantastic.

Kate Towers: 00:08:39

Because it can be a bit daunting to, you know, to go out and find somebody to sort of create what it is that you have in your head. So I think it's amazing that you just went and did. Yeah. And I would say with the kind of the green cards, so some suppliers will do a number of products. So then I, I wasn't necessarily going to print wrapping paper and I saw that they, they did offer this service. So and with this particular supplier you could order proofs and You know, samples and things, so I could see what the quality would possibly be like. And then they would, they also offer like a first batch of your cars for free. So you can actually see the quality in print which is fantastic. So it's just kind of like communicating with them and asking them, you know, This is what I have, what could be the best route for me. And then when I got the gift prep, oh my gosh, I fell in love. I was just super excited. So yeah, sometimes I think things lead into other things as well. Yeah, that makes sense.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:09:42

And I think I really like what you said about getting samples as well. Cause I agree that so important is of you not just to sort of take someone's word for it or, you know, it might look like what you're after, but there's nothing that compares to actually having it in your hands and been able to feel it. And you see that it really, it really is what you were looking for. Yeah. So, how did how did you go from doing this for, I guess, for, for fun and designing thing, you know, things just for, for yourself to actually deciding it was going to become a business, when did that happen and how did that come about?

Kate Towers: 00:10:18

Yeah, I mean, I've always wanted to start. Business and maybe I'm putting my name to it, which I found really scary. Because you know, you are putting yourself out there to be judged, to be liked, and everyone obviously wants to be liked and what's their product and you love your product, but you don't know what reaction it may get. Or even if it's, you know, you could do all the research in the world, but until you launch something you're never going to know. And for me, I kind of I just thought I'd go for it. And I just, I didn't want to necessarily invest in an online shop straight away. Cause obviously you do have the monthly charges for that. So I thought I would, I need to really build my following and how am I going to do that? Because the market at the moment is hugely saturated. Fabulous, small creative businesses, especially since lockdown. And I've just found that it's, it is really hard to promote yourself and to advertise yourself and to get seen. So I really thought I need to start working on my social media. I'm not to be honest, the lover of Facebook, although I do use it by app see love Instagram, but I think it really lends itself to my products because it's obviously very visual. So I was looking at ways of how I can maybe. You know, get myself out there more, you could say through Instagram. And from that I started to develop I wanted a way to sell my products and you can't you can't obviously sell on Instagram unless you've got one online shop because you have to link it. But the next best thing was for me to launch an Etsy shop. So you can put your link in your bio. So it'll send you through to your Etsy shop. So I sat at sea, which is very straightforward to do. You just have to kind of make sure that you use the correct descriptive words. So if you think how someone will find your product. So, you know, in a lot of my titles it's colorful or rainbows or something. Yeah, so then I just really thought go for it. You haven't got a lot to lose on it. Say it's no. Huge upfront cost. So and it's basically a shop window to your product. So I set that up. Yeah. And then just started trading from there really. I mean, my first, my first was actually to a family member. It's my uncle, which was actually really lovely. But more followed from that, which is wonderful. And I think then kind of just trying to find. A good retain of advertising myself whilst continuing to sell, continuing to update it. See, because it is a lot of work. You do have to, you know, be a photographer, you have to be a designer, a creative, you know, you have to write content.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:13:09

So it, it's kind of like a lot of hats to wear, but you know, that comes part and parcel when you're running your own business. Yeah, absolutely. And I think your Instagram is fantastic by the way. I think it's really good. It's really, it's what I like is really bright and colorful and just beautiful. So it looks really good. And so when you're talking about advertising your business am I right in thinking that you don't do any paid advertising as such, but you're sort of just promoting what you do on Instagram or are you doing any paid advertising alongside that?

Kate Towers: 00:13:41

Yeah, so. When I launched my business, I had it was around five, 500 by 1,500 followers. I don't have a massive following at all. I really don't and I'm trying to grow it and I'm finding it the hardest thing to do in Instagram. And, you know, I am making connections and, you know, talking to people, but you it's so hard to get seen. So I did actually. I paid for a few Instagram adverts. Now they're very low cost and you can set your target audience. So my target audience would be people in like like-minded people. So people that maybe like color or have kind of small businesses. So, and I really found these really beneficial and I would, you know, gain a, quite a few followers just because I'm being advertised to. No this new yeah, this, this, this, these new people, and I don't think I would have reached them. Yeah. Without doing, doing the adverts. I don't really do it. Like, I dunno, I think I've done two a month or something like that for over three days and only spend, you know, I think it's like $6 or something per time, but I really did find it a good way to rate and those people have actually become so I would say, you know, don't spend a lot of money into it, but yeah. Do you look at it? If it's something, how, how you're growing your business, what, what is out there? You know, and I continue to try and advertise my Instagram. And it is sometimes word of mouth. You know, you have people that obviously advertise here and you meet small creatives and, and that can, you know, you run competitions and things, which is fantastic. And although I absolutely agree, it's not about the followers and how many followers you have. You do want to reach a mass market. So you do have to try these fields of advertising or competitions, or so I, although a lot of people say about advertising, you know, is a bit a waste of money. I will say that I found it really beneficial.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:15:56

That's really good to hear. Thank you. When you were talking about how hard it is to grow an Instagram, art is melting alone. Cause I find exactly the same. I've never done any advertising and hadn't even considered it. So it's really nice to hear from someone who's done it and that it's worked for you. And I can totally see that for if you're selling products, particularly ones that look beautiful that I can see, definitely see that it could work. It sounds so that you really have to know who you're targeting. That's probably the key to getting it right. Yeah. So we asked you actually, when you want to run an ad and see, do you want to, who do you want to target?

Kate Towers: 00:16:32

So like the mass market or like-minded people, or there is another option, which I can't quite remember. And I always put kind of like-minded people. Cause then I think, you know, I don't want followers for the sake of followers. I want to target the right people who, you know, have affiliation with what I'm doing. So yeah, there are options of how you, and what do you want from it? Do you. More website clicks. Do you want more profile visits? And for me, it's always about profile visits, not about making the sales, it's making the connections and to kind of like communicate that across to a potential customer. You know, they might not be a customer at the point of following you, but it's a really good place to start.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:17:13

Yeah, definitely. And speaking of customers can, can you see anywhere because I don't really know how the Etsy analytics work. Can you see where you're getting customers from? So wherever they're coming over from Instagram or wherever, they're finding you on it, see, can you see it?

Kate Towers: 00:17:27

Yeah. Yeah. It gives you a lot of reports. So yeah, I pull, I pull them on a monthly basis just so I can be a bit more aware and the majority of them are for Instagram and then for Betsy and then pre Facebook. So, and I don't advertise for it. See but yeah, and I've had, actually, I've spoken to quite a few customers that have said, oh, I found you on Instagram. Oh. And then I bought this on Etsy, which is wonderful. Although, hopefully very soon I will be launching a website. Now it is a bit of a bigger commitment. It's not a lot of money a month, but it depends, you know, on, I guess what you think your traffic may be. But I just feel like it's definitely worth. Investigating that and trying it, and, and it will give people obviously an additional avenue to buy your product, but it will also open it up on Instagram. Cause then you can actually link products, link the account as what you can't do for Etsy. So some people that may not have an Etsy account or thing, you know, they don't want to do guest checkout. It might be a better option doing it this way. So it's going to be really interesting to see. You know, if they're, if they're both kind of appetized through Instagram where the traffic is coming from. Yeah. That is interesting because if it sounds like people are probably going through Instagram profile now and then clicking, just clicking on the link, which takes them to Etsy. So yeah, I definitely think that a weapon. Trying to website sounds sensible. Cause hopefully they say people would just come and click on the link and go to your site. So yeah, I think, I definitely think it's worth looking into I think it would be different if most of your sales are coming from Etsy, you know, from the Etsy search, but it sounds like your plans have you, you spoke about how at the start you decided the first thing you were going to do is build your Instagram following and it sounds like. Really has paid off. Yeah. I really think, especially if you're just going to go straight ahead with an Etsy account, you know, as I said, it's so saturated, every avenue is, I mean, you know, whoever it's not on the high street, wherever it is, Amazon, you know, it is really hard to be found unless you're paying for ads and, you know, I don't have massive budgets. So I thought a free way of advertising is obviously social media. And although that's a saturated market, I did start to look at kind of how you can create that following. So, you know, maybe similar companies look at them and then looking at who their followers are. And then trying to, in some way, kind of enticing those people onto your page, or even collect through collaborations. I've just done a really great collaboration. It was like 17 days of giveaways with the color nest, which is a fabulously colorful account. And yeah, I, I took part in that and it was a wonderful way to support small businesses, but also to meet people and to gain kind of maybe new followers and, you know, just doing things a little outside the box, I guess or trying to, yeah, that's really good advice.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:20:40

Thank you. So when did you start your Instagram and when did you set up your Etsy store? I'm just, I'm just interested if you don't mind me asking.

Kate Towers: 00:20:48

Yeah. And as I said, I've, I've I've I started kind of this road about five years ago. And I've always had. Not a keen interest in it. See, I think it's a fantastic tool. And I kind of, I did start a company called OHI previous to Kate towers designs, which was also based around color. But I, I just couldn't. I just didn't put the time into it. I'd say, and I had an Etsy store and teenage sounds were kind of here and there. And then it wasn't till probably the end of last year. I thought, you know what, I'm really in for my sampling. I'm going to change the name. I'm going to rebrand. I'm going to do it. I'm just going to go for it. I'm going to put all my efforts in and yeah. And I definitely think it's really paying off. You know, of course I've had some wonderful, sow's have had some great feedback, great customers, you know, Plans for the future for the Kate towers design. But I really every, I think Etsy is a really good platform to start because, because there is a window to, you know, your customers have a window TA. And I think if you just launch a website, you know, It's very, very, unless people know about you, you're not going to get the amount of traffic that possibly you would in Etsy. So it's good to start kind of somewhere that has, you know, some advertising to it and the might be easier for your potential customers to find you. And then once you have them, you can bring them along on the journey and then maybe set up a website.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:22:30

Yeah, that really makes sense. Thank you. And did you feel, so when you changed to Kate tower's design, does anything, did it feel different having your name to the products?

Kate Towers: 00:22:40

Yeah, completely. Yeah. And it was really scary because I love what I do. But I don't often show my face and things like that. Only because. I don't know, it feels, I think because it's so personal to me and the things I make and it's for experiences and it's really hard. So maybe sometimes to tell your story or to, you know, to show your face in that. So putting my name behind my brand was a bit like if I'm going to do it, I'm going to do it. And so I did, and it was a bit like no turning back because you can't hide behind it because it's your name. And I definitely think it empowered me and my business a little bit more. Well, that's really interesting.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:23:22

Thank you. And that was the end of last year, wasn't it? That you rebranded? Because I do remember the rebrand. And was that when you're at sea still your new Etsy store went live or was that a bit?

Kate Towers: 00:23:31

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, no, it did. It went like then. And yeah, it's just, I mean, it's grown and it's, it's wonderful. And you know, it's, it's not all sunshine and rainbows there's, there was, you know, it might be weeks where I'm inundated with cells and then there could go weeks that you don't get any, and it is, you know, it is quite difficult. I think with that, with a small business, to be a bit like defeat us or be a bit flat But you just, I can't, I think you just kind of have to keep going and, you know, if it's his quiet and that's not working, so how can look at other ways? Like how can you boost that? Okay. So I could do something through my social media to then get my followers to move to Etsy. You know, so yeah, it was around the same time. With the rebrand. Yeah. Thank you. And how does it work in terms of sorts of having busy weeks and quiet weeks? How does that work logistically?

Vicki Weinberg: 00:24:28

So do you have stock sort of when I say sat there, you know what I mean? Do you have stock that's ready to be sent to customers? Or if somebody orders something, do you have to then sort of do a print run? How, how does that work? Because I'm guessing that that that must be quite hard to manage. If you have busy weeks followed by quite a while.

Kate Towers: 00:24:47

Yeah. So I love to get my orders out within like two days. And I try my best to do that. I'm a big stickler for delivery timings. So I'll have an amount of products made. So cushions, for instance, I'll make up like a batch of cushions and then prints. I print them. Myself and my prints and cards are because I've obviously got them from suppliers. I've got them in batches. They're very small bacterias, but obviously in it say, I only put the constitute in that I have. So I can't sell something, obviously if I don't have it. But with cushions and things, you can make them and I can make them overnight. I'll just have a really long. One not and, you know, and do it, then I'll get up super early and, and do things. And you do make it work and sometimes it can be overwhelming, but it's what you want to do. And if you've made the choice that you want to do that you do find a way to definitely make that way.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:25:44

Yeah, thank you. And before we cause there's lots of other things I want to touch on, but before we do, I just wondered if you had any other sort of advice specific to selling on Etsy or anything you wants people to be aware of or things you think that are worth doing at the start.

Kate Towers: 00:26:01

Yeah, I definitely think you need to pay attention obviously to descriptive words. So people find your products, which will be in the main title. So like I said, think of everything or ask family and friends, you know, if you wanted to find this card, for instance, You know, a card may be, if you wanted a rainbow card, what would you put into the tie? You know, your, your search engine for you'd put things like, could I greeting cards, rainbow greeting cards, you know? So you have to think along the lines of how will people find you. And then I definitely think one of the massive things is photos. So the photos of your products, you've got to have really good photos and I've struggled with this because I think some people. Don't lend themselves to, you know, fantastic photos such as images and prints in frames because you get the reflection and they're so hard to photograph. And, you know, I have had people say, oh, it's much better in real life. And I think like, you know, and because I don't pay a photographer I bought myself a light box, which you can buy for, you know, 20 pounds on eBay, which is actually really good. Okay. That was one of my tips. I would definitely invest in a light box and to photograph your products. But yeah, I would say be very careful of your images and make sure they're a very high quality, very clean you know, not, not many filters on it because you want to make sure that, you know, you're advertising the product that the customer is going to receive. So yeah, I would say really focus on those two.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:27:39

That's really useful. Thank you. Cause I, you know, I don't really sell on that. Same how we have added it's Ellis on here before, but it's really useful. I think, to get everyone's advice on how to do it successfully, because I believe like, like you say, with all marketplaces now it's really saturated. And if you're just getting started now, it's just getting harder and harder is my understanding anyway.

Kate Towers: 00:27:59

Yeah. And I also think, sorry, reviews are great. Everyone leaves reviews. But if you can kind of maybe nudge your customers into leaving a review. I know I personally, when I shop on it, see, I look at reviews and now reviews can even include pictures. And I had a wonderful customer that sent to her cushion was on her outdoor garden and see, and it just looked fantastic and I thought that's kind of, that's great advertising. So yeah. No.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:28:27

That's fantastic. And do you do anything to get those reviews? Is there anything that you can do on Etsy to encourage reviews?

Kate Towers: 00:28:34

Yeah, I mean, I think they're able to leave review after, I think it's like a few weeks after purchase and. You know, you do have a direct contact to these customers by emailing. You don't know their email number email address, but you can send them some communication. And I don't think it hurts to say, you know, it won't mind, you could leave me a review or offer a 10% discount code. You know, it's just, it really, I think it really does help. Customers make a decision on buying a product from your business. I agree. And I think whatever marketplace you sell on is really important, but they are really hard to get. And it's really good to know that on Etsy, you have the ability to contact the customer and ask for one, because I think I know that if someone emails me and asked me to leave me a review, I always do. And I try and leave a review for everything that I buy, but let's face it. Sometimes things. So partially by, especially when marketplaces have rules, about how long you have to leave it before you can review your products and things like that. So, yeah, I think sending an email, just saying, please, can you leave one? It's really good. And yeah, I really like the fact that you can have pictures as well. I actually saw that when I looked the new, see some of the images, it looks great. It looks nice to see how people use things in their homes, as well as a customer gives you some ideas of what you could do as well, which I think is really nice. Yeah, because I will say thinking Instagram is very much about real life as well. Although you can take a wonderful product picture or shoving it in your home or showing it in a customer's home, you know, it really does give people inspiration. So if you can get that, it's fabulous, but you could also put maybe on your social media, you know, if you bought from me, please leave me a review.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:30:23

Sometimes people just need a reminder. Absolutely. I think we're all busy. Aren't we? And we just need prompting to do things. And speaking of ideas, Kate, where do you get inspiration for your products? Because they're all really bright and beautiful, and I love the hearts and the rain bays. Where, where does it come from?

Kate Towers: 00:30:41

I think fi having a five-year-old girl probably helps he's very colorful. I think it comes from, it just comes from kind of like, you know, nature words and quotes time. I see, or hear patterns. They literally could be anything. I mean, the other day I was walking down the street and there was a lady standing next to a post box. So it was a bright red postbox. And she had like this gorgeous magenta scale. And I looked at the color scheme and I felt God. That color match is fantastic. I must use that somewhere and I did, I designed a card with similar colors in it, so it's kind of, it really does come from anywhere. I think if I look back who inspires me other than kind of some of my fellow creatives on Instagram. I would say I love designers Guild. I've always been absolutely obsessed with their textures and their fabrics and that they use of color and pattern. And then I look at people like Emily Cox head, he is fabulous with words and quotes. So it really does come from anywhere. And I think because it, because I am so inspired by color, you can see it in everyday. You know, it's like, because like I said, I can walk down the street, I can walk past my river, the local river, and you know, I'll see some dragonflies and I'll think, oh gosh, that would be really good. So really can come from anywhere. Thank you. And I know it might be a really hard question as hopes. It might be asking it, but I'm not, I don't consider myself creative.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:32:17

So I love hearing where people get their inspiration from. I just find that genuinely really interesting. So I've just got a few questions before we finish up Kate. The first thing I thought we touched on, if you don't mind is obviously you mentioned that you've got a family and I know you've got young families. I also have a five-year old girl. How We S we spoke as well before we started recording about the fact that you will say, have a, have a day job as well. So how are you, how are you managing to sort of, I don't want to say juggle, cause Jocko might not be the right word, but how are you managing everything? Cause it sounds like a lot.

Kate Towers: 00:32:55

Yeah. It's not easy. You know, you want it all, you want a business, you want a family, you wants a balance that You know, it, you have to sometimes have a job as well, because, you know, especially when you start off you know, you have to obviously build up the income. So, you know, many of us need to continue working and that may be full time. So it's extremely difficult. But I look at kind of opportunities where I can maybe even just, you know, be inspired. So I'll take my kids out and I'll, you know, and like I said, when I'm out, I'll see something in nature that inspires me. I'll do some drawing with my little one, and then I'll be like, join a rainbow while I'm doing that. So it's a bit of an idea of a design. You know, I always put notes in my phone. Wherever I am wherever I was on the train going to work or wherever I was you know, sitting on a bench outside of park, kind of just get some side notes to myself as some quotes that popped into my head or a good idea for a range. But yeah, really fitting it in. You do have to fit it in around the family. So sometimes I work, you know, in the evening, sometimes I get out. If I, in fact, prefer getting up a bit earlier, I'm not great in the evenings, get ready to it. So yeah, it's again, up an hour early for the kids and just doing some Dade lane outpacing daily in bed.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:34:23

You know, it's, it's really working out way. You can get yeah. Time for it. My husband is super supportive and I'm very lucky to have someone that will take the kids for a couple of hours whilst I sew a few cushions. So I think it's, it's about trying to balance it and it's not easy. And you know, you, you do have to make some sacrifices. I will say, you know, there's been times where I've been at work and I've come home and had to work. And I feel very guilty that I haven't seen my kids that night. But it is about balance and that's not an everyday situation. So you just need to make sure there is that healthy balance between everything that you're doing, because you don't want to work yourself. You know, it's meant to be fun. It's meant to be fun. You want to do it because it's your passion. So there will be nothing worse than thinking. It's like a chore. So trying to find, find the time where it, where you can read. Yeah, and I don't want to put words into your mouth, but it does sound like one thing that I've sort of got from this whole conversation we've had is that because you really enjoy it. It's kind of just what you do. So if you see what I mean, I kind of get the impression that yeah. You get inspiration all the time and you're sort of doodling when you can. And that sounds sort of nice that it kind of, it's just something, that's something that you. Do rather than being a chore. Yeah. I honestly think I couldn't not do this now. You know, it's, it's, it's too much of a pattern. It's probably more of a passion. I think. I don't know. I've always been someone that juggles a lot. Like I could do a million things, feed the kids, put the Washington, like I'm, you know, I can do quite a lot of things at once. And You know, something that I enjoy and it, although I can feel pressured at times I have a million things, but it doesn't feel, it doesn't feel like I shouldn't be doing it or that it's too much because if I didn't have it in my life, I think there would be a really big. On field. And I do think, you know, I am a wife, I am a mom, I have a family, but I, this is full. It is for all of them, but it's very much for me and having something that I am so passionate about. And I, I so important, even if it's hobbies and it's not businesses of people having something, that's just for you. I think he's just so important. And because it's creative, it's definitely like an outlet for me. You know, especially if your job is mundane or it's not as exciting, it's fantastic that I've got this colorful world that I can, you know, moving. Absolutely. And I think it's amazing that you've got something that you're passionate about, that you can also build a business around as well. And as you say, you could, you could have obviously kept it as a hobby. He didn't have to turn it into a business, but I think the fact that you're passionate about your business public really does help when you have to get up early and so cushions or wherever it is because yeah, it has really come across when I've spoke to you, just how much. Yeah, and I definitely have drive. Like, I want it to be a business. I want it to be my life. I want to do this. So, you know, I'm not going to be able to do that if I don't get on with it. So I do put all my energies into it. And yeah, I love that. Absolutely. Yeah. So say it can be this. You can really tell. So thank you. I've got one final question before we finish Kate, if you don't mind, it's a question I ask everybody, which is, what is your number one piece of advice to anyone else wanting to go down a similar path?

Kate Towers: 00:38:11

Although I would like to say, go for it. I would very much like to say, because it's all about, you know, my business and where it started of, you know, mindfulness and kind of making people feel good and comforted. And I would say that, you know, you can't do all the things all of the time. So, and by that, I mean, you know, you really need to do step back in your business and see what the business needs are. Cause it's tough doing it all. You know, be selective when creating, if anyone's like me, I'll have a zillion ideas that I want to do all of them. So you have to kind of write these down and put them to the side, really look at what's going to grow and develop your business, even though it might be something that looks really fun today. And also breathe. You know, this is meant to be fun. Your mental wants to do this. It should be your passion. And I really, yeah. So I just think, knowing that, you know, you have to do all these things, but sometimes it's not physically possible. So there are things that if you can get outsourced or if you can put things to the side and you know, you, you are a person. You're not a machine. But I think so. I think that's really important to remember. Cause you can put a lot of pressure on yourself to get things right. To get things done to deadline. So yeah, just, you can't do all the things all the time. Thank you. And that's something that I think I need to hear as well because yeah, I think I'm sure a lot of us are guilty of sort of putting pressure on ourselves when it's not coming from anywhere else.

Vicki Weinberg: 00:39:50

Yeah. Yeah. Being quite hard on ourselves. So thank you. That's fantastic advice and thank you for everything you've shared. So I will link in the show notes, this episode to your Etsy store and your Instagram and possibly your website. That might be like before, before this episodes. And I will definitely share that whenever, whenever it's there. So just thank you, Kate. Thank you so much for all that you shared. Oh, thank you so much. I love listening to your podcast, so it's nice to be on one of them. Yeah. And I look forward to hearing it so nice of you to say thank you. Hi, thank you so much for listening as always. I would absolutely love to know what you thought of this episode. Please do remember to rate and review the show and also most importantly subscribe. So you don't miss out on any future episodes. And as a reminder, I release a new episode every single Friday. So take care and look forward to speaking to you again.